The Egotistical Priest
An irreverent and opinionated discussion of the many classes
in the World of Warcraft gaming universe.
Hunter Shot Rotation
by Vonya
I WAS going to post on my addons for Vonya today. But I forgot. So instead, I’m going to talk about my shot rotation, and how I get between 800 and 1,100 dps in pre-Kara gear.
Now that I have your attention, I’ll give some small addendums. The 1,100 dps was with shaman buffs, drums, and I think I also had a pally buff. The 800 is what I normally get when we do instance runs. When I solo, I can’t even come near those numbers, because I’d pull aggro constantly from my pet. Also, I do actually have one piece of Kara gear - my old guild had a slot that needed filling until a missing guild member appeared, so we took down Attumen and got his wrist armor.
However, since I have seen hunters in very very good gear who thought they were doing well to crank out 500 dps, I wanted to debunk the myth.
For hunters, DPS is determined by shot rotation, and augmented by gear.
I’ll say it again.
For hunters, DPS is determined by shot rotation, and augmented by gear.
If your shot rotation is horrid, no gear is going to fix your constantly flagging dps. Sure, you’ll get boosts from gear upgrades, but you won’t see the true benefit of the gear.
I have discussed some of the key tenets of hunter theorycraft in my posts on Hunter Macros and LittleTrouble.
Around the time I made my LittleTrouble post, there was talk of autoshots no longer being clipped quite as mercilessly by steady shots. I didn’t get the opportunity to test that at the time, but based on tests I’ve done recently, that’s a load of horsehockey.
Steady Shot, as of right now, pre WotLK, still clips your Auto Shot, and this still has an incredible adverse affect on your dps.
And here’s the point where I say something that makes half of you stop listening.
I don’t use a shot rotation macro.
I hate them, I have to be completely honest with you. You could give me mathematical, categorical proof that they’d up my dps, and I would still not use one. For me, personally, reducing a complex and enjoyable class to a single button is killing all the joy I get out of that class. I know that MANY players love and rely on macros. Our own hunter uses a macro, and that allows him to pay attention and call out things like infernals on Prince. That’s fine. That’s just not how I personally enjoy the game.
So my shot rotation isn’t going to help people who rely on macros to get their dps.
Let’s see…did I cover all the legalese? Probably not, but if I didn’t leave holes for you guys to poke in the comments, it just wouldn’t be as much fun, now would it?
So I’ll start from the base shot, and add in my rotation from there. Hopefully that’ll make it easy to see what I’m doing.
AS = Auto Shot
SS = Steady Shot
ArS = Arcane Shot
KC = Kill Command
Just Autoshooting
AS………..AS……….AS………AS……….AS……….AS
Nothing special here - right click on the mob and do nothing else, this is what you get. Remember, AutoShot is your Bread and Butter shot. It’s where most of your DPS should always come from.
Adding in Arcane Shot
AS.ArS-…….AS……….AS………AS……….AS.ArS-…….AS
Arcane Shot is the highest DPS shot that we can include in the rotation. It’s very mana intensive, but at the moment, we’re not worrying about that. It’s instant cast, so it only takes up the global cooldown, but it has a longer cooldown that allows it to be used every fourth AutoShot or so.
I added a dash ‘-’ to the graphic to indicate the global cooldown. During that time, you cannot cast another shot.
I’d also like to point out that I’m using it at the BEGINNING of the AutoShot rotation. I do this for a few reasons, one of which I’ll cover in a moment. Also, although it’s difficult, it is NOT impossible to clip an AutoShot with an Arcane Shot. I’ve done it, but I have to be either very unlucky or trying really hard to accomplish it. The bigger reason is because Arcane Shot trips the global cooldown, which means it can keep me from casting another shot quickly in the next Auto Shot slot. Which leads us to….
Adding in Steady Shot
AS.ArS-…….AS.SS—-…AS.SS—-..AS.SS—–.AS.ArS-…….AS
Steady Shot WILL clip AutoShot if it’s not fired off at the right time. Personally, I use the LittleTrouble Addon so I know exactly when to time it. I’ve found that hitting the button JUST as the AutoShot seems to be ending yeilds the best results for me. Server lag keeps that from clipping my shots (it took me some experimentation to find the right timing) and Steady Shot gets off as quickly as possible, making it less likely to clip the NEXT auto shot.
Steady Shot is more mana efficient than Arcane Shot, but does less damage. On the other hand, it doesn’t have a cooldown, just a cast time. You could, theoretically, chain cast Steady Shot, but that would clip almost all of your AutoShots and drastically reduce your dps.
You’ll note in my totally professional graphic up there that I indicated with a large group of dashes just how much of the AutoShot time is taken up with the casting of Steady Shot. Timing is key - even a second can mean the difference between a clipped shot and a perfect rotation.
But we’re not done! Look at all that time left between the AutoShots on the rounds where we do the Arcane Shots! Surely we can fill that up with something useful….
Adding in Kill Command
AS.ArS-..KC-..AS.SS—-…AS.SS—-..AS.SS—–.AS.ArS-..KC-..AS
That looks much better! Very few dots left (dots being time not spent on DPS). Kill Command may not be the best dps ability we’ve got, but there’s no reason not to trigger it while we’ve got the opportunity. There’s just enough time in that Auto Shot gap for you to slip in both an Arcane Shot and a Kill Command.
Kill Command, for those who don’t want to look it up themselves, is triggered whenever YOU (the hunter) land a critical strike. It tells your pet to land an extra attack for X amount of damage. So it’s going to be available pretty often, but it’s honestly not impressive (or reliable) enough dps to consider using it instead of either an Arcane Shot or a Steady Shot. Using this method, you don’t sacrifice any of your shot dps, and you still get to use it. You may not get to use it quite as often as if you were spamming the key, but you still use it more often than if you only used shots.
Alternately, you could add a sting in there. I’m very guilty of never using my stings. Things just don’t usually live long enough for it to matter. On bosses, I could probably put up the poison sting in the first Arcane Shot companion slot, instead of a Kill Command, and see if that improved the DPS. That would require me to actually do more instances with Khuuna though, and she mostly solos and farms. Those furious crawdads up in Skettis? Yeah, they’re mad at HER.
And, of course, in the expansion, there is talk about how steady shot will no longer clip auto shots. I know. I’m focusing on the here-and-now, not the what-may-possibly-happen-later. Also, I didn’t add in any of my “special” stuff - my KittyBomb macro (Kittybomb is Bestial Wrath, trinket, and Rapid Fire) isn’t in here, and neither are the sometimes-needed pet stuns and things like that.
USE YOUR KITTYBOMB, beastmaster hunters! Use it! Don’t save it up for the boss fights, go ahead and use it on trash. Don’t wait. Use it. Don’t worry about clipping your autoshot with it. The dps boost from it is too high to try and “slip it in”. And yes, if you’re good, you can still slip Steady Shots in your rotation, even with Kittybomb. I can say from experience that drums + kittybomb + shaman buff pretty much negates steady shots. Don’t even try. But if it’s just kittybomb, you can still slip in some Steadies.
August 28th, 2008
Actually Arcane and Steady have a RAP point where one catches and passes the other.
If my numbers are right anytime you hit 1000 RAP your steady shot should surpass the arcane shot.
I wont argue macro vs non macro since thats all hoey
I use a macro more because my job tends to be protect the innocent and oh btw top the dps charts. The macro just lets me focus on something other than the fight without sacraficing dps.
As a side note, please feed your melee based pets kibble bits your dps will appreciate it
August 28th, 2008
Bah .. I wish there was an edit feature here
The 1000 RAP is the cross over point, so in theory 1001 AP is where your ss dmg surpasses your arcane shot.
Since Im posting a follow up here’s the math I used
ss = rap*.02+150
arcane = rap*.15+200
If your a hunter and cant get a run to save your soul, I highly recommend a bg or two every day. Yes those welfare epic’s will probably put your stats upside down for a long fight but your dps will tend to go up drastically for short to medium fights.
August 28th, 2008
I am curious as to how you justify the use of an addon -
(An application created outside the game by a 3rd party to create a function that does not exist natively in the game.)
Yet cringe at the use of a macro -
(An in game function since the conception of the game, and developed and maintained by the game producer.)
I feel is everyones personal choice to choose how they play their hunter, use or don’t use what ever functions make it right for you. But is does seam to counter logic to say no to macros but yes to addons.
[Note: Yes it is quite possible to weave your shots with out the use of a casting bar, many of us old school hunters had been doing it from day one, by keying off of the shot animation and/or sound.]
P.S. - LOVE your blog keep up the fantastic work. Cheers.
August 28th, 2008
I don’t believe KC triggers the global cooldown thats why its used in macros, to be cast along with the SS as soon as a KC is available.
Guns, Bows, and Crossbows also make a difference with Autoshot weaving. Keep your eyes on the speed depending on your Hunter Spec. Faster is better for BM because we don’t have those other shots MM’s have but if you struggle to weave SS in that fast get a slower shooter as you’ll have more time to get the shots figured out.
And practice with Rapid Fire on your own, soloing, to make sure you’re ready for the shot rotation change from the huge haste bonus. This practice will help too whenever a Bloodlust, love shammys, goes off and you’re like “whoa I’m huge and shooting a lot.”
August 28th, 2008
Speaking of kibble…I’ve found, in a purely anecdotal way, mind you, that without kibble my pet absolutely cannot hold aggro from my hunter…and yes, that’s watching the threat meter like a hawk and waiting for Smoke (ghost saber ftw!) to get a good 1.5k-2k threat lead. Really, it bears actually parsing the numbers, but I have my suspicions that the recent change to the growl mechanic may be what’s at work here. The kibble boosts the pet’s AP enough so growl then is able to produce enough threat to hold aggro when that opening aimed shot crits for 2k or more, I don’t get a face full of mob.
Yes, I open with aimed shot…wanna fight about it?
August 28th, 2008
I think what your seeing with your pet isn’t so much tied into growl as it is into the fact that damage itself is threat. Growl is still supposed to be based off the hunters RAP, blizzard has been screwing around with that lately but thats their official line.
So the +strength from the kibbles makes your pet hit harder so smoke is generating more threat per attack.
I took aimed shot off my attack bars long ago, I dont want to think about the agro I would build if that thing ever went crit during a boss fight
August 28th, 2008
Lol I open with aimed shot as well (though it Crits for well over 3k), question though..are you all BM hunters? I am MM and I use a shot macro that cast (or attempts to) Kill Command everytime I cast SS, I never use AS because it is so much worse than my SS (I have 2002 AP right now 1 kara piece) Where you put KC in your rotation is my Serpent sting and just before a pull if I am not required as CC I drop either Snake or fire trap (unless we have a pally tank then I use Explosive)
I don’t understand why you say you can’t use SS when Rapid Fire and Bloodlust is up, I am a troll so I add in my berserk ability for the extra 10-30% haste and if IAotH is up my SS is almost instant cast lol. I hit 1487 DPS in heroic Shattered Halls on Bladefist (think my pet DPS was like 50 or something lol)
I don’t use any hunter add ons but I have made a few macro’s to help me out for when I am required to CC, so that I can focus on kiting and trapping without sacrificing my DPS too much. I am not an “Old school hunter” I actually only hit 70 a week ago on this guy, but I was doing heroic Shattered Halls since 68 (needed the rep for “The Marksmans Bow” =])
August 28th, 2008
@ Vonya
Well, space goat, you’ve done it now! You should know better than to invoke “how to huntar”.
My my my. You try to show your basic shots for a non-raiding, barely Kara-sized hunter, and why they work for you, and everyone who’s ever looked at the hunter class pops up to politely disagree. From math that ignores the armor of your target (wouldn’t that be nice!) to the ubiquitous smileyface!
I’m waiting to hear from a Ranger, next, really.
Alas for me, belonging to the race that seems to be the perfect draw for the “xoLegolassox” type class. Don’t worry, though. Soon there will be Death Knights, and then everyone will get to be an expert on a different solo class! Mmmmm, gives me warm fuzzies.
August 28th, 2008
@ Hannelore
=) =) =) I can make more if you want lol. BTW I am an expert on every class I level to 70 as I like to excel at what I do both in and out of game. I am not a math guy but game mechanics are really easy to figure out and don’t change just because you re-roll.
August 28th, 2008
@Hannah
I am an expert on all things. I would have thought this would have been evident by now.
September 3rd, 2008
There is so much fail here I don’t even know where to begin. You can no longer interrupt auto shot with a steady shot once that auto shot has started casting (auto has a 0.5 second cast time). If you start to cast just before the auto starts casting, then yes, it will clip it. However it does not clip it during that .5 second cast, and that is huge. Do all the testing you want if you don’t believe me. Steady shot also invokes the global cooldown but has no cooldown of its own. It ends up with very odd behavior that lets you do a 3:2 rotation which is the most dps you can do. If you’re not concerned about doing the most dps you can do, don’t play a hunter and don’t raid.
Arcane shot scales horribly compared to steady shot. Even with ignoring armor, steady shot will surpass it with enough AP. Arcane shot should only be used in raids if you are moving or something needs to be dispelled (rare). Stings scale even worse. The only time you should consider using a sting in a raid is if someone is getting hit much harder than usual and you need to put scorpid up to give a cushion. Think people getting fel raged on Bloodboil, or RoS phase 1. Never ever use serpent sting.
Kill Command is actually a decent amount of damage. http://wowwebstats.com/jdzp2egrckmq5?s=253288-276217&a=x389bde Last Gorefiend it did about as much as my pet’s yellow damage. If I had a ravager or a cat, it would have easily surpassed it. For procs, it counts as an attack made by your pet. This makes it a critical part of FI uptime as well as frenzy uptime.
September 6th, 2008
There’s really something to be taken from the irony of a situation once you sit back and actually look at it.
On the one hand, Ego makes a post that for better or worse is looking to change the hunter community in some way. Now, because he has genuine concerns about this obviously Esoth feels he has to respond, as is well within his right, and clearly does not feel he is changed for the better by the post. He says that she is a failure because her information in his opinion is flawed.
Then you have Esoth, who creates a post that begins with “There is so much fail…” which while an eloquent display of one’s capabilities to be an asinine pissant without putting much effort into it, will automatically switch any receptiveness for what is to follow off on the part of Ego. Thus, in stating that she has “failed” to effectively teach others, he in turn has done just that by being incapable of diffusing his own ego and self-esteem issues from the message he had to give.
Don’t get me wrong, I find being abrasive to be very fun, but it isn’t informative. If someone doesn’t like what you have to say they generally don’t listen, and in this case to borrow your own poignant phrase, Esoth, “there is so much fail” in your introductory statement that I don’t know where to begin. Well, that’s a lie I know exactly where to begin — the first sentence.
Constructive criticism will always garner better results than acidic assertions, and so long as you fail to grasp that concept I wouldn’t be surprised if you feel the world is out to “ignore” you because no one takes your “brilliant” view point seriously. Look at yourself in the mirror, give yourself a big smile, and say “Hey guy, you matter”.
Once you’ve done that, it is my belief you’ll be able to post without trying to prove that to everyone while disproving the importance of someone else’s belief.
Or, you could just be a belligerent muppet, which is cool I guess, but don’t expect much more than indifference after you’ve burnt your vehement core into smoldering ashes.
September 12th, 2008
pictures make me happy
http://elitistjerks.com/f31/t13107-hunter_shot_rotation_illustrated/